Timestamps are in GMT/BST.
| 00:06:39 | | raptor Quit () |
| 00:22:25 | | IAmBeard has joined |
| 00:33:39 | Heyub | I love my lips! |
| 00:36:08 | IAmBeard | if my lips every left my mouth, packed their bags and headed south? |
| 00:36:17 | IAmBeard | same wavelength? |
| 00:36:41 | IAmBeard | sam686, does bitfighter use vc++ on windows? no mingw32? |
| 00:37:05 | Heyub | hehe you know the song :D |
| 00:37:38 | IAmBeard | veggie tales was a good time back in the day |
| 00:38:24 | Heyub | All of my friends hate veggie tales. |
| 00:39:05 | IAmBeard | well if they don't appreciate the humor, or don't appreciate christian family-friendly shows, I can see that |
| 00:45:03 | | raptor has joined |
| 00:45:04 | | ChanServ sets mode +o raptor |
| 00:45:20 | sam686 | yes, bitfighter use vc++ at the monent (watusimoto uses vc++ 2010 express which is freeware) |
| 00:45:50 | IAmBeard | yeah, i have vc express, i'm more of a linux/mingw guy |
| 00:45:55 | raptor | i've toyed with mingw - i got the zap/ directory to compile, but not TNL (or maybe it was the other way around) |
| 00:45:59 | IAmBeard | so I might see how plausible it is to port it to mingw |
| 00:46:07 | IAmBeard | maybe port isn't the right word in this context |
| 00:46:11 | raptor | it's plausible, but I don't see the benefit |
| 00:46:20 | IAmBeard | just a preference, that's all |
| 00:46:21 | sam686 | i use visual studio professional 2008, which came from some computer contest several years ago (being in a top 4 places).. |
| 00:46:25 | raptor | but mostly because i'm not on windows :) |
| 00:47:02 | raptor | mingw also tends to produce rather large binaries because it like to link in all of libstdc++ |
| 00:47:35 | IAmBeard | that's optional, just need to add some params to gcc |
| 00:47:54 | raptor | i've tried that, but i still had to include the library on the side |
| 00:48:13 | IAmBeard | *g++ |
| 00:48:19 | IAmBeard | oh, that sucks |
| 00:48:32 | raptor | but i am not an expert - and it was about a year ago |
| 00:48:38 | IAmBeard | for me, i just had vc++'s interface, i'm more of the notepad++ sort of guy |
| 00:49:54 | IAmBeard | but I'm sure I can manage |
| 00:50:06 | IAmBeard | anywho, i'm off for the evening, i'll try and be online most of tomorrow again |
| 00:50:26 | raptor | later! |
| 00:50:37 | IAmBeard | i work from home doing contract software dev, and I think tomorrow is slow (the company i'm working for is going through a dev planning session) |
| 00:50:40 | IAmBeard | night |
| 00:50:50 | raptor | night |
| 00:50:56 | | IAmBeard Quit (Quit: Page closed) |
| 01:04:59 | Heyub | If pinoccio said "my nose will now grow" what would happen? |
| 01:06:01 | raptor | a black hole would form? |
| 01:06:27 | Heyub | Its a paradox. |
| 01:06:30 | raptor | like when you divide by zero |
| 01:06:43 | raptor | ...and succeed |
| 01:10:55 | raptor | ok, back later... |
| 01:10:56 | | raptor Quit () |
| 03:22:15 | | raptor has joined |
| 03:22:16 | | ChanServ sets mode +o raptor |
| 03:33:23 | | BFLogBot - Commit 66b3ee8ff6fe | Author: sam8641 | Log: Add level random option, and option to skip uploaded files but still allow changing to uploaded levels |
| 03:33:32 | raptor | hi sam686 |
| 03:33:48 | sam686 | hi |
| 03:34:11 | raptor | tell me about the skip uploaded files option |
| 03:34:41 | raptor | is that a server setting so that uploaded files are not in the level rotation? |
| 03:34:50 | sam686 | it could skip uploaded files when desiding what the next level will be (when the level ended like usual) |
| 03:35:02 | sam686 | yes |
| 03:35:19 | sam686 | but, they are still listed and can be playable in "play different level" |
| 03:35:34 | raptor | is that INI-only? |
| 03:35:43 | sam686 | yes, for now.. |
| 03:36:13 | raptor | i like the random idea |
| 03:37:09 | sam686 | i have added /random in-game command as well (and ini option to randomize at the end of level) |
| 03:37:49 | sam686 | just a hint, /random only works on updated servers (mine will be updated in a few minutes.. compiling) |
| 03:38:08 | raptor | ah, so you kept it protocol-compatible |
| 03:38:49 | sam686 | yes, |
| 03:39:12 | sam686 | there is something called "GameType::processServerCommand" that reads client command string (the ones not in a client side command list) |
| 03:39:30 | raptor | it should probably be added to the client commands... |
| 03:39:42 | raptor | but that would break protocol |
| 03:39:58 | sam686 | it could work to send c2sRequestLevelChange(ServerGame::RANDOM_LEVEL, false) from client side, but will just ack like REPLAY_LEVEL on old servers |
| 03:40:33 | raptor | the only reason to have it client-side is so it is documented well in the help menus, etc. |
| 03:40:48 | raptor | and do permission checking before sending the RPC call |
| 03:41:37 | sam686 | ok, i can try doing that (and with the use of checking GameConnection::CONNECT_VERSION it can tell the server is outdated and gave warning /random is not supported on old server) |
| 03:47:24 | raptor | oh yeah... i had a 64bit windows patch |
| 03:47:28 | raptor | should i apply that? |
| 03:47:36 | raptor | i can't remember why i didn't... |
| 03:48:17 | sam686 | i guess you haven't asked watusimoto, though i don't know if Watusimoto uses 64-bit computer |
| 03:48:24 | sam686 | my old computers is only 32-bit |
| 03:48:24 | raptor | ah that's right |
| 03:48:34 | raptor | yeah, this would allow both in the vc++ project |
| 03:48:42 | raptor | well for the vc++ 2010 project only.. |
| 03:48:51 | sam686 | maybe yes |
| 03:49:14 | Heyub | I have a 64 bit windows. |
| 03:49:20 | sam686 | vc++ 2008 is a bit outdated for 64-bit CPU anyway... |
| 03:49:22 | raptor | i remember why!: because I couldn't figure how to do a 64bit installer... |
| 03:49:40 | raptor | NSIS wouldn't install it into the appropriate 64bit directory |
| 03:51:14 | raptor | I even got all the dependencies to compile 64bit... |
| 03:51:55 | sam686 | what would you do about installer? use a different, and 64-bit installer? |
| 03:52:12 | raptor | not sure - i'm still research |
| 03:52:14 | raptor | ing |
| 03:52:17 | raptor | maybe use MSI? |
| 03:52:43 | raptor | but it's complicated and i'm not excited about learning another installer for a platform i don't use.. :) |
| 03:55:19 | raptor | found some good tips: http://bojan-komazec.blogspot.com/2011/10/nsis-installer-for-64-bit-windows.html |
| 03:55:43 | raptor | but that still requires 32bit libraries on a 64bit system, so no installing on windows server 2008! |
| 03:57:18 | Heyub | Whats the advantage of offering a 64 bit version? A game as simple as bitfighter I can't imagine how much it would effect things... |
| 03:57:28 | raptor | only that it runs natively |
| 03:57:43 | raptor | which just means more efficiently |
| 03:57:52 | raptor | but it's not lig bitfighter is a hog... |
| 03:57:55 | raptor | *like |
| 03:58:26 | raptor | the only other advantage would be when the next version of windows (or next after that) doesn't have 32bit libraries anymore |
| 03:58:32 | raptor | then you couldn't play |
| 03:58:39 | raptor | but that's probably several years off |
| 03:58:42 | Heyub | I have a mac also. |
| 03:58:51 | Heyub | Infact I hope to never buy a windows computer again. |
| 03:58:57 | raptor | I do make a 64bit only mac package |
| 03:59:20 | Heyub | I didn't know that. |
| 03:59:34 | Heyub | My mac is a PPC though, kind of old. |
| 03:59:40 | raptor | every system has 32bit and 64bit variants, except women |
| 04:00:07 | Heyub | Im afraid your humor is lost on me. |
| 04:01:14 | raptor | oh crud |
| 04:01:27 | raptor | i merged a discussion with my wife into my response... |
| 04:01:44 | Heyub | lol |
| 04:01:50 | raptor | i meant 'except windows' |
| 04:02:08 | raptor | ok, no more two conversations at once for me... |
| 04:03:12 | raptor | the 32bit mac package i build has support for PPC |
| 04:03:15 | Heyub | Well, if you ever do make a 64bit windows package, I could be the test subject. |
| 04:03:24 | raptor | ok cool |
| 04:03:28 | | BFLogBot - Commit a0f791527c56 | Author: sam8641 | Log: Client side random levels (which add command list in help screen) |
| 04:03:43 | Heyub | I am very glad it does, so few games support PPC anymore. |
| 04:03:57 | sam686 | i wonder if there is 64-bit PPC mac out there... probably not. |
| 04:04:03 | raptor | there is |
| 04:04:07 | Heyub | I own one sam |
| 04:04:27 | raptor | you have a G5, then? |
| 04:04:31 | Heyub | Yup |
| 04:04:35 | raptor | cool! |
| 04:04:39 | raptor | and bitfighter runs ok? |
| 04:04:50 | Heyub | Smooth until you add 1k asteroids. |
| 04:04:53 | raptor | haha |
| 04:05:08 | Heyub | Though I dont think thats a problem ;) |
| 04:05:26 | raptor | because you are our second ppc player... |
| 04:05:46 | Heyub | Oh? |
| 04:05:50 | raptor | the other one is Little_Apple and BlackBird (brothers) |
| 04:05:56 | sam686 | i guess PPC G5 is 64-bit, G4 (and older) is 32-bit |
| 04:05:58 | raptor | they have an old G3 |
| 04:06:12 | Heyub | My dad has a G3 in the other room.. |
| 04:06:17 | sam686 | still, if any PPC mac is out there, it will probably be old |
| 04:06:35 | raptor | if it runs Tiger (10.3) it should play bitfighter :) |
| 04:06:42 | raptor | sorry, 10.4 |
| 04:06:50 | raptor | 10.3 is waaaay too old |
| 04:06:54 | Heyub | Well, I know we've played zap! on it :) |
| 04:07:21 | Heyub | My dad is kind of anti-computer game |
| 04:07:29 | raptor | zap! ran on 10.3, but i could never get bitfighter to compile on it because of the newer frameworks we use |
| 04:07:57 | Heyub | well, Im just surprised g3s still work. |
| 04:08:06 | sam686 | i have heard some ppc mac users can't play bitfighter (even through they could play Zap) mostly due to tiger 10.3 |
| 04:08:29 | raptor | tiger is 10.4 (right?) i can't remember what 10.3 is |
| 04:08:42 | sam686 | or i get mixed up |
| 04:08:50 | Heyub | lol |
| 04:09:13 | raptor | Heyub: were you the one with the PS2 controller? |
| 04:09:22 | Heyub | Panther is 10.4 |
| 04:09:23 | Heyub | err |
| 04:09:26 | raptor | or sam686, was that you? |
| 04:09:26 | Heyub | Panther is 10.3 |
| 04:09:32 | Heyub | I dont have a ps2 controller lol |
| 04:09:43 | raptor | someone recently told me they had to change the PS2 profile in the joysticks_presets.ini |
| 04:09:46 | sam686 | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OS_X#Versions |
| 04:09:56 | raptor | maybe it was beard or raptor |
| 04:10:01 | raptor | oops, i mean Renderwahn |
| 04:10:07 | Heyub | Your raptor :P |
| 04:10:18 | raptor | hey... i am! fancy that.. |
| 04:10:49 | sam686 | i guess PC2 controller users is rare on windows, mostly because of having to have a Port converter to USB that not many people have... |
| 04:11:17 | sam686 | PS3 / xbox360 controller have USB plugs that easily plugs into windows |
| 04:11:44 | sam686 | i mean, computer, not windows... |
| 04:12:22 | raptor | that reminds me... we need to be able to support analog joysticks somehow |
| 04:12:29 | raptor | sorry, analog triggers |
| 04:12:45 | sam686 | windows computer have driver problems with PS3 (have tofind and install some custom drivers from website) |
| 04:14:10 | sam686 | what will the analog triggers do when halfway pressed? enable the use of half-shield weak-shield or repair slower? |
| 04:14:36 | raptor | i think we should just translate it do on/off like normal triggers |
| 04:14:47 | raptor | probably just detecting if an axis is negative |
| 04:17:28 | raptor | Heyub: does that mean you run 10.5 on your G5? |
| 04:17:38 | raptor | or 10.4 |
| 04:27:55 | | raptor Quit () |
| 04:28:09 | | raptor has joined |
| 04:28:09 | | raptor Quit (Changing host) |
| 04:28:10 | | raptor has joined |
| 04:28:10 | | ChanServ sets mode +o raptor |
| 04:28:40 | raptor | now you all know my secret identity |
| 04:29:22 | Heyub | Yes I run 10.5 |
| 04:29:40 | sam686 | yes, maybe you join too fast without waiting for nickserv to tell you that you are authenticated... |
| 04:29:52 | sam686 | or maybe you auto-join too fast |
| 04:29:54 | raptor | i pushed the sleep button combo on my laptop by accident... |
| 04:30:31 | Heyub | lol |
| 04:31:15 | sam686 | if I put my computer on sleep, i will just "ping time out" (my IRC client doesn't know the computer is going to sleep) |
| 04:31:41 | sam686 | then, sometimes, i re-join too fast see a duplicate of myself... |
| 04:31:46 | Heyub | I always quit what Im running before putting my computer to sleep. |
| 04:31:55 | raptor | yeah yeah yeah... |
| 04:31:56 | sam686 | before a time ping out of 260 seconds does ping time out |
| 04:36:07 | Heyub | Well... Im going to bed now. |
| 04:36:12 | raptor | night |
| 04:36:17 | Heyub | Good night :) |
| 04:36:36 | | Heyub Quit (Quit: KVIrc 4.0.4 Insomnia http://www.kvirc.net/) |
| 04:43:31 | raptor | sam686: where is your clone.bot again? |
| 04:45:04 | raptor | found it: http://sam686.maxhushahn.com/bitfighter/robots/clone.bot |
| 04:53:34 | | BFLogBot - Commit 93214e93bbb3 | Author: sam8641 | Log: "/random" now works on old 017 servers, though it won't know the level min / maxPlayers to skip |
| 05:16:47 | raptor | i can't compile: linker error: undefined reference to `Zap::ServerGame::RANDOM_LEVEL |
| 05:16:52 | raptor | which is really weird |
| 05:18:24 | raptor | i think i know the problem |
| 05:18:28 | raptor | it's the order... |
| 05:20:24 | sam686 | Not sure why thats an error... |
| 05:20:32 | sam686 | i don't get any errors... |
| 05:20:34 | raptor | i foudn out why, committing soon... |
| 05:23:07 | raptor | nope, didn't work... |
| 05:23:09 | raptor | weird |
| 05:23:26 | sam686 | static const S32 RANDOM_LEVEL = -4; so it shouldn't be a link error? |
| 05:23:36 | raptor | exactly |
| 05:24:06 | sam686 | full recompiled? |
| 05:24:32 | raptor | yep |
| 05:24:58 | sam686 | it compiled ok for me (on a0f791527c56) for ZAP_DEDICATED and is running as bitfighter sam686 |
| 05:25:55 | sam686 | does the link error happens on non-debug too? does the error not happen on dedicated_debug? |
| 05:26:10 | sam686 | what revision are you on by the way? |
| 05:27:42 | raptor | the latest |
| 05:28:12 | raptor | issue is stupid: gcc won't let me compile with two static consts in trinary logic statements |
| 05:28:28 | raptor | ternary |
| 05:28:29 | raptor | i mean |
| 05:28:34 | raptor | with the ? : |
| 05:29:12 | sam686 | i might think its a bug in some versions of gcc? |
| 05:29:16 | raptor | here is the bug: http://gcc.gnu.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=42101 |
| 05:29:47 | sam686 | which gcc version are you using? |
| 05:30:09 | raptor | 4.6.2 |
| 05:30:22 | sam686 | gcc --version gcc (GCC) 4.1.2 20080704 (Red Hat 4.1.2-51) |
| 05:31:23 | raptor | huh, they say it isn't a bug |
| 05:31:31 | raptor | but a problem with the c++ spec |
| 05:31:55 | sam686 | does your problem happen with -O2 too? |
| 05:32:09 | raptor | trying... |
| 05:33:39 | sam686 | while at it, let me try "make dedicated_debug" and see if i get link error or not... |
| 05:33:56 | raptor | nope, no errors with -O2 |
| 05:33:58 | raptor | weird |
| 05:35:00 | raptor | here is a better description: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/5446005/why-dont-static-member-variables-play-well-with-the-ternary-operator |
| 05:37:03 | sam686 | ServerGame.o: In function `Zap::ServerGame::idle(unsigned int)': |
| 05:37:03 | sam686 | /home/sam686/bf017/zap/ServerGame.cpp:1458: undefined reference to `Zap::ServerGame::RANDOM_LEVEL' |
| 05:37:03 | sam686 | /home/sam686/bf017/zap/ServerGame.cpp:1458: undefined reference to `Zap::ServerGame::NEXT_LEVEL' |
| 05:37:03 | sam686 | ServerGame.o: In function `Zap::ServerGame::suspendGame()': |
| 05:37:03 | sam686 | /home/sam686/bf017/zap/ServerGame.cpp:853: undefined reference to `Zap::ServerGame::RANDOM_LEVEL' |
| 05:37:04 | sam686 | /home/sam686/bf017/zap/ServerGame.cpp:853: undefined reference to `Zap::ServerGame::NEXT_LEVEL' |
| 05:37:15 | raptor | ha! |
| 05:37:27 | sam686 | i don't get any problem with -O2 |
| 05:37:30 | raptor | well i'm going to change them to not use ternary logic.. |
| 05:42:29 | raptor | ok push |
| 05:42:36 | raptor | i mean, pushed |
| 05:43:41 | | BFLogBot - Commit 3e351f12075e | Author: buckyballreaction | Log: Fix really wacky linking errors when using static const declarations without definitions. GCC why do you have to be so pedantic?? |
| 05:48:43 | | BFLogBot - Commit f7a35292bf7a | Author: buckyballreaction | Log: Clarification on last commit |
| 05:54:46 | raptor | sam686: i'm trying to build a bot... when could the method bot:getLoc() be nil? |
| 05:54:49 | sam686 | its strange how such a wacky problem does not happen when using -O2 ... they could of at least have a compile error/warning about that problem earliear.. |
| 05:55:00 | sam686 | when robot dies? |
| 05:55:01 | raptor | i'm getting this error: ***ROBOT ERROR*** Robot error handling event Tick: robots/sentinel.bot:21: attempt to call method 'getLoc' (a nil value). Shutting bot down. |
| 05:55:10 | sam686 | not sure.. |
| 05:55:54 | sam686 | or maybe "getLoc" don't exist? or "bot" is nil? |
| 05:56:13 | sam686 | or the arguments are nil? |
| 05:56:43 | sam686 | what is "sentinel.bot" by the way? |
| 05:57:24 | raptor | just a hybrid of orbit_bot and s_bot and clone_bot |
| 05:57:33 | raptor | :) |
| 05:57:39 | raptor | just a test to see if i can create a bot... |
| 06:06:40 | raptor | i'll try and finish it soon and put it on the forums... |
| 06:06:45 | raptor | it's just a goofy test |
| 06:23:15 | sam686 | my clone bots is producing millions of lines of "Finding objects will be far more efficient if your script provides a table -- see scripting docs for details!" when doing /addbots 50 clone 0 some_name_dont_exist |
| 06:23:36 | raptor | yeah - you have to remove the 'bot:' from findGlobalItems |
| 06:34:32 | sam686 | i guess thats why it never cache the scripts anymore... bool cacheScripts = false; |
| 06:34:48 | raptor | where did you find that? |
| 06:35:21 | sam686 | luaObject.cpp at the top of LuaScriptRunner::loadScript() |
| 06:35:46 | sam686 | about line 645 |
| 06:36:27 | raptor | huh, i bet watusimoto did that temporarily |
| 06:38:57 | | BFLogBot - Commit 22b606c5a80e | Author: sam8641 | Log: add ClearAllCachedScripts() and "/clearcache" |
| 06:38:59 | sam686 | What I did is add clearcache |
| 06:39:31 | sam686 | maybe... temperory, , until we figure out how to tell if that file have changed... |
| 06:46:43 | sam686 | sleepy? |
| 06:46:47 | raptor | very... |
| 06:46:52 | raptor | but i want to finish my dumb bot |
| 06:47:18 | sam686 | your dumb bot will be too sleepy to even play, i guess.... |
| 06:47:43 | raptor | haha |
| 06:54:50 | sam686 | Fatal error running Lua code: . Possibly out of memory? Shutting down Bitfighter. |
| 06:55:12 | sam686 | thats after doing several of /addbots 100 /kickbots |
| 06:55:38 | raptor | i just got a lua segfault, too |
| 06:57:09 | sam686 | http://sam686.maxhushahn.com/upload/text1204/120427_01-04-01.txt |
| 06:57:30 | sam686 | it happen to jsut freeze with high CPU usage... it didn't segfault though |
| 06:57:58 | raptor | here is mine: http://pastebin.com/HPS3c0HM |
| 07:01:21 | raptor | huh, s_bot doesn't crash it, just my bot |
| 07:04:05 | | sam686|2 has joined |
| 07:04:06 | | sam686 Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 07:04:20 | sam686|2 | i guess, in my case, it is stuck in NetInterface::~NetInterface() function loop (mConnectionList.size() never goes to zero) |
| 07:04:29 | | sam686|2 is now known as sam686 |
| 07:04:29 | | ChanServ sets mode +v sam686 |
| 07:04:50 | raptor | huh |
| 07:04:54 | raptor | that is odd |
| 07:05:15 | sam686 | probably memory corruption somewhere, what causes it though? |
| 07:06:44 | raptor | my sentinel bot... |
| 07:09:45 | sam686 | umm, is it kindof crashy with bool cacheScripts = true; but not with bool cacheScripts = false; ? |
| 07:10:27 | raptor | maybe that's the problem.. |
| 07:10:41 | raptor | that makes sense actually, i have changed the script a lot in game.. |
| 07:15:25 | sam686 | but... it doesn't want to crash on my computer it seems... |
| 07:18:14 | raptor | ok, i got a crash after starting it fresh - same exact stack trace |
| 07:18:33 | raptor | it's always on the tickEvent firing |
| 07:22:34 | sam686 | Fatal error running Lua code: . Possibly out of memory? Shutting down Bitfighter. |
| 07:22:35 | sam686 | Program exited normally. |
| 07:22:45 | raptor | yeah, it's my bot... |
| 07:22:50 | sam686 | though this time it just quits when it shouldn't quit |
| 07:23:11 | sam686 | happens with 100 robots and letting the game end (ends in 10 seconds) |
| 07:23:14 | raptor | we need better lua handling if the script has an error |
| 07:31:21 | sam686 | i need to get to sleep, bye |
| 07:31:25 | raptor | good night |
| 07:31:30 | | sam686 has left |
| 08:14:11 | | BFLogBot - Commit 933b52cbc8dc | Author: buckyballreaction | Log: Fix reporting when ship is dead to lua scripts |
| 09:08:16 | | raptor Quit () |
| 13:32:14 | | IAmBeard has joined |
| 14:13:22 | | Heyub has joined |
| 14:13:52 | Heyub | Good morning |
| 14:19:03 | IAmBeard | good morning |
| 14:19:14 | IAmBeard | http://bitfighter.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1456&p=14353#p14353 |
| 14:19:23 | IAmBeard | ^ Any features in the feature forum you want to see? |
| 14:23:44 | Heyub | You could probably add a module that simply increases the amount of power the player has, since there is already an armor module. Though you may want to add some negative such as the harder to control part of the armor module. |
| 14:27:28 | Heyub | Maybe it is already in the .ini, but I've always wanted a feature where the player could set a default loadout, rather than selecting every time what he wants. |
| 14:30:27 | IAmBeard | Yeah, i can look into that |
| 14:31:25 | IAmBeard | added to the list |
| 14:33:03 | Heyub | I like the idea of an experimental version, allows an opportunity to try those wild ideas not everyone likes at first glance. I wish you luck :) |
| 14:34:14 | IAmBeard | :) Thanks |
| 14:34:44 | IAmBeard | this gives me an oppurtunity to showcase some of my skills to the other devs, too, since so far I've been a lot of talk, but not a whole lot to show |
| 14:35:03 | IAmBeard | and frankly, no one really knows who I am other than a wild man that just joined the community |
| 14:36:09 | Heyub | If you know veggie tales you must be cool! I think it has to do with the fact that watusimoto is on a weekend business trip or something, he sort of leads the operation from what I have seen. |
| 14:36:29 | IAmBeard | yeah, that's what raptor was telling me |
| 14:39:24 | IAmBeard | yeah, veggie tales was a good time - i actually didn't watch much of it, I've never been a big tv/movie watcher |
| 14:39:37 | IAmBeard | only a few episodes here and there |
| 14:40:26 | Heyub | Yeah, about the same here, though I've listened to most of the silly songs on youtube :P |
| 14:40:35 | IAmBeard | heh :D |
| 15:39:56 | | Watusimoto has joined |
| 15:40:19 | Heyub | Hello Watusimoto |
| 15:47:27 | | raptor has joined |
| 15:47:28 | | ChanServ sets mode +o raptor |
| 15:48:09 | raptor | good day! |
| 15:48:36 | raptor | Watusimoto: is that you or one of your kids hijacking the computer for games? |
| 15:49:56 | Heyub | lol |
| 15:54:53 | IAmBeard | raptor, does that happen often? |
| 15:55:03 | raptor | what |
| 15:55:09 | raptor | ok, Watusimoto's kids? |
| 15:55:13 | raptor | all the time :) |
| 15:55:17 | IAmBeard | hah |
| 15:55:20 | raptor | but they never respond |
| 16:04:12 | | Heyub Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 16:04:12 | | Heyub has joined |
| 16:06:29 | | Little_Apple has joined |
| 16:06:43 | Heyub | Hello apple |
| 16:06:47 | Little_Apple | helloo there |
| 16:06:57 | Little_Apple | wazzaaaaaaaap |
| 16:07:22 | raptor | Little_Apple: hi |
| 16:07:27 | Little_Apple | hellooooo |
| 16:07:35 | raptor | you're not still sick are you? |
| 16:07:44 | Little_Apple | lol :3 |
| 16:07:59 | Heyub | Maybe hes playing hooky :P |
| 16:08:07 | raptor | he always plays hooky |
| 16:08:16 | Little_Apple | lol |
| 16:09:07 | Little_Apple | raptor |
| 16:09:09 | raptor | Little_Apple: so what do you think of my first attempt at bot creation (despite it being a blatant rip-off of three other bot's code)? |
| 16:09:18 | raptor | yes |
| 16:09:23 | Little_Apple | i havent gotten the chance to try it out just yet :P |
| 16:09:28 | Little_Apple | um |
| 16:09:41 | raptor | ok |
| 16:09:43 | Little_Apple | what kind of music would you be looking for for bitfighter? |
| 16:09:50 | raptor | umm... cool |
| 16:09:53 | raptor | uh, cool music? |
| 16:10:00 | raptor | i don't know... |
| 16:10:08 | raptor | good music |
| 16:10:15 | raptor | (except no one liked beethoven) |
| 16:10:18 | Little_Apple | like chiptunes? or just normal electronica? |
| 16:10:36 | Little_Apple | or dubstep? |
| 16:10:44 | raptor | i think we found that chiptunes fit the look and feel of the game, but wear you down a bit.. |
| 16:10:57 | Little_Apple | i mean chip tunes as a style |
| 16:11:04 | raptor | yes, me too |
| 16:11:20 | raptor | you remember what i think about dubstep... |
| 16:11:24 | Little_Apple | :3 |
| 16:12:01 | Little_Apple | im assuming that we want instrumental music |
| 16:12:05 | raptor | the thing that has me hung up is the ditribution of the music: there is no way to do it without making the game download really, really large |
| 16:12:17 | Little_Apple | yeaaa |
| 16:12:35 | Heyub | Hmm... |
| 16:12:42 | raptor | probably - although i haven't tested Carmina Burana with Bitfighter yet... :0 |
| 16:12:44 | Little_Apple | it seems like what makes some games download over a really long time is the graphics and sound files |
| 16:12:51 | raptor | definitely |
| 16:13:10 | Little_Apple | whats nice about bit fighter is that there are no graphics files :D |
| 16:13:13 | Heyub | This is how an open source game I know deals with it: http://wz2100.net/download |
| 16:13:20 | IAmBeard | have you gents thought of the server streaming music, or hooking into services like rdio? |
| 16:13:27 | Little_Apple | :o |
| 16:13:38 | Little_Apple | i don't know..... |
| 16:14:04 | raptor | IAmBeard: we aim to keep bandwidth as low as possible, so it has to be client-side or coming from a different server (like last.fm) |
| 16:14:18 | raptor | Heyub: maybe a separate music pack? |
| 16:14:22 | raptor | that might be a good idea |
| 16:14:33 | Heyub | Thats what warzone did with their videos |
| 16:15:12 | Little_Apple | im assuming if there was a server side radio option it would make everyone lag like crazy as does 4 people using voice chat at the same time lags a server |
| 16:15:24 | Heyub | the high quality is pretty much 10x the size of the game itself |
| 16:15:31 | raptor | ha! |
| 16:15:42 | Little_Apple | wow |
| 16:16:05 | Heyub | Its nice because I can download the game and play it, then download the videos and use them the next day lol |
| 16:16:19 | raptor | Little_Apple: if we did a separate music pack on the download page, would you download it? |
| 16:16:21 | IAmBeard | raptor, is the server single threaded? |
| 16:16:35 | Little_Apple | i don't know if i would download it |
| 16:16:54 | raptor | IAmBeard: for the most part yes; a couple things are done in side threads to not hang up the master loop - like master server authentication |
| 16:17:09 | Little_Apple | i think most people would rather go do something else when a game is downloading than have to download two separate things |
| 16:17:14 | raptor | so i guess that means 'mostly single-threaded' |
| 16:17:17 | IAmBeard | and is there only one socket being used per player connection? |
| 16:17:51 | raptor | server side, one port is open, and each client has their own connection |
| 16:17:54 | IAmBeard | we could certainly improve performance by putting audio communication in a seperate thread |
| 16:18:08 | IAmBeard | and perhaps a seperate socket |
| 16:18:28 | Little_Apple | raptor |
| 16:18:31 | raptor | yes |
| 16:18:32 | IAmBeard | although we could always just queue the data from the socket rather than two sockets |
| 16:18:43 | Little_Apple | remember how i was talking about voice chatting bots? |
| 16:18:55 | Little_Apple | its a terrible idea. |
| 16:19:03 | raptor | IAmBeard: sound data is sent via RPC and queued like everything else |
| 16:19:20 | raptor | the issue is bandwidth mostly, although sam686 would know better than I |
| 16:19:33 | raptor | Little_Apple: changed your mind? |
| 16:19:38 | Little_Apple | yep |
| 16:19:40 | IAmBeard | if it's bandwidth, i suspect a seperate thread would help |
| 16:19:46 | IAmBeard | i'll add it to my todo list |
| 16:19:59 | raptor | no amount of threading could help with bandwidth problems |
| 16:20:04 | Little_Apple | if someone were to add like 10 or so voice chat bots it would kill a server with massive amounts of lag |
| 16:20:24 | raptor | but threading could help with processing the compressed data into packets |
| 16:20:48 | raptor | Little_Apple: and you know someone would do it... |
| 16:20:58 | Little_Apple | it would be like everyone in a bbb all using voice chat at the same time |
| 16:21:06 | Little_Apple | i know i might do it :P |
| 16:21:19 | raptor | ha |
| 16:21:22 | | kodaws has joined |
| 16:22:57 | raptor | IAmBeard: sorry, I don't mean to be absolute when I say threading won't help bandwidth: it *may* help latency which can appear to help overall gameplay. But I suspect that TNL already does this |
| 16:23:06 | Heyub | >.< My controller stopped working so I opened it up... They didn't sauter the wires, they just glued them >.> |
| 16:23:25 | IAmBeard | raptor, i understand, don't worry :) |
| 16:25:07 | raptor | Heyub: ha! it drives me crazy at how less durable everything is nowadays because we've gone with the cheapest manufacturers for everything |
| 16:25:23 | raptor | (as a country... I'm in the US) |
| 16:26:09 | Little_Apple | yay! frailty! |
| 16:26:12 | | Watusimoto Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 16:26:35 | Heyub | Im in the US also |
| 16:26:44 | Little_Apple | YOU ESS AYYY |
| 16:26:54 | | raptor sighs |
| 16:26:58 | Little_Apple | :3 |
| 16:27:29 | Little_Apple | oh look. |
| 16:27:30 | IAmBeard | so I was just thinking to myself, and I was like - frig, bitfighter needs gravity wells |
| 16:27:37 | Little_Apple | princess celestia on tv. |
| 16:27:41 | Renderwahn | but if things would last forever, nobody would buy new stuff! |
| 16:27:48 | | Watusimoto has joined |
| 16:27:53 | | Renderwahn mumbles something about planned obsolescense |
| 16:27:55 | raptor | heh - i think Watusimoto actually attempted gravity wells once |
| 16:28:12 | IAmBeard | i have the code with another physics engine, it's pretty neat |
| 16:28:24 | raptor | there is a thread (maybe a couple) on the topic in the forums that would provide historical context |
| 16:28:29 | IAmBeard | i can link you to some of the chipmunk physics experiments I've done, if you want |
| 16:28:38 | Little_Apple | :o |
| 16:29:36 | IAmBeard | https://code.google.com/p/chipmunk-freebasic/ |
| 16:29:59 | IAmBeard | i only have win32 binaries in there |
| 16:30:06 | IAmBeard | i could do some linux ones |
| 16:30:18 | IAmBeard | but i'd have to setup a VM for that one |
| 16:31:00 | Little_Apple | hey raptor |
| 16:31:18 | Little_Apple | how about hawaiian music in bitfighter? c: |
| 16:31:21 | raptor | checked otu and compiled chipmunk-physics, nice and lightweight at first glance... |
| 16:31:31 | raptor | Little_Apple: polynesion? |
| 16:31:44 | Little_Apple | hawaiian. leik ze ukulele. |
| 16:31:59 | raptor | maybe you could record a ukulele song for us! |
| 16:32:06 | Little_Apple | :3 |
| 16:32:51 | raptor | IAmBeard: you wrote teh freebasic port? |
| 16:32:56 | Little_Apple | i probably could if i could figure out how to get this mic working |
| 16:32:59 | IAmBeard | yup |
| 16:33:12 | IAmBeard | in the freebasic world, I go by the name "Oz" |
| 16:33:18 | raptor | cool |
| 16:33:34 | raptor | not i'm not too familiar with freebasic, is your port header-only? |
| 16:33:39 | Little_Apple | A WIZARD? |
| 16:33:50 | IAmBeard | yeah, freebasic uses gcc as a backend, so it's just a header translation |
| 16:34:01 | IAmBeard | all done by hand though, i never trust automated tools |
| 16:34:05 | Little_Apple | WWEEEEERE OFF TO SEE THE WIZARD! THE WONDERFUL WIZARD OF OZ!!!!! |
| 16:34:13 | IAmBeard | well, not that sort, anyway |
| 16:34:25 | IAmBeard | Little_Apple , you got the idea :) |
| 16:34:29 | Little_Apple | :P |
| 16:34:41 | raptor | pay no attention to the man behind the curtain |
| 16:34:46 | Little_Apple | xD |
| 16:35:41 | | Watusimoto Quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) |
| 16:42:26 | raptor | the chipmunk demo is neat |
| 16:42:40 | IAmBeard | i have a few in there |
| 16:42:47 | IAmBeard | sorry I didn't document them overly well |
| 16:42:59 | raptor | i'm looking at the official git repo |
| 16:43:00 | IAmBeard | but most of them are mouse left click is drag, right click is spawn |
| 16:43:06 | IAmBeard | oh, that one |
| 16:43:07 | IAmBeard | :P |
| 16:43:18 | IAmBeard | yeah, they do lots of crazy awesome stuff in it |
| 16:57:45 | raptor | oooo... one way platforms... |
| 17:05:34 | | Little_Apple Quit (Quit: Page closed) |
| 17:08:17 | | Little_Apple has joined |
| 17:08:24 | Little_Apple | raspberries |
| 17:08:34 | raptor | are tasty |
| 17:09:13 | Little_Apple | :3 |
| 17:09:22 | Little_Apple | im gonna test your sentinel bot now |
| 17:09:24 | Little_Apple | :P |
| 17:09:36 | raptor | ha, ok |
| 17:09:53 | raptor | note that i finished it really late last night... so it may blow up your computer |
| 17:10:14 | Little_Apple | lol |
| 17:11:09 | Little_Apple | i was thinking of doing something like this except it wouldnt merge bot codes, it would only modify an sbot to be in defense mode all the time and it would think a specific player was the flag |
| 17:11:52 | Heyub | It did ok |
| 17:12:19 | Heyub | The orbit made it an annoying partner though, I was shooting it as often as my target. |
| 17:12:20 | raptor | I wonder if I could make it detect if it was set to attack someone, then rename it 'TerrorBot' |
| 17:12:38 | Little_Apple | >:D |
| 17:14:48 | Heyub | I past chumpchange.0 |
| 17:14:56 | raptor | hooray! |
| 17:15:27 | raptor | Little_Apple: where is your test server? |
| 17:15:46 | Little_Apple | its not working for some reason ._. |
| 17:16:24 | Little_Apple | oh i know what it is |
| 17:16:45 | Little_Apple | it would probably help to save the file first >__> |
| 17:16:52 | raptor | ha! |
| 17:17:15 | Heyub | lol |
| 17:17:21 | Little_Apple | :P |
| 17:17:46 | Little_Apple | yay it works! |
| 17:17:53 | Little_Apple | not in bitmatch though lol :3 |
| 17:24:27 | Little_Apple | laters |
| 17:24:30 | | Little_Apple Quit (Quit: Page closed) |
| 17:28:16 | | Watusimoto has joined |
| 18:08:40 | Heyub | My biggest problem is that the left side of my brain has nothing right in it, and the right side of my brain has nothing left of it. |
| 18:08:52 | raptor | hahaha |
| 18:11:20 | raptor | where do you come up with this stuff.. |
| 18:11:55 | Heyub | lol I don't my friends sends me it |
| 18:30:28 | Heyub | Question, in bitfighter there is a "generic joystick" controller option, but in the joystick_presets.ini I cant find any with that name? |
| 18:30:50 | raptor | let me look... |
| 18:31:08 | raptor | did you update from 016? |
| 18:31:20 | Heyub | Yes |
| 18:31:21 | raptor | or install fresh? |
| 18:31:28 | Heyub | UH |
| 18:32:07 | Heyub | I have 12A and 17A on my computer lol |
| 18:32:13 | raptor | haha |
| 18:32:36 | | Watusimoto Quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) |
| 18:33:30 | raptor | huh - it looks like we put the generic profile in the code so it'd always be available |
| 18:34:42 | raptor | If you want to make your own, i think the [LogitechDualAction] profile is the closest to generic |
| 18:35:24 | Heyub | Ok, my dual action broke, trying to get my saitek joystick to work. |
| 18:35:37 | raptor | awww |
| 18:36:20 | raptor | if you look at the diagnostics screen in bitfighter (F7) you can get the correct 'raw' values for axis, buttons, name, etc.. |
| 18:36:48 | Heyub | Oo, thats good to know, thank you. |
| 18:45:01 | raptor | and in fact, if you get a profile working right for a new joystick, i'll add it into the next release |
| 18:45:31 | Heyub | Alright, what does "searchstring" do? |
| 18:46:01 | raptor | i explained it all at the top of the INI, let me look again (i can't remember...) |
| 18:48:05 | Heyub | Oh, silly me, I should read :) |
| 18:48:32 | raptor | as yes, SearchString is what SDL (the bitfighter framework) detects. You can see it in diagnostics in purple somewhere |
| 18:49:09 | Heyub | Yeah, I found it :) |
| 18:56:37 | Heyub | I don't think it will be possible, too few axis'. |
| 18:56:56 | raptor | how? |
| 18:57:02 | raptor | we support like 32 axis |
| 18:58:35 | Heyub | Well, it has to do with the aiming, there is the two axis of the joystick itself, then there is the rutter on the joystick (twisting left/right) then the throttle... |
| 18:59:29 | raptor | not a dual axis? |
| 18:59:42 | raptor | oh.. so you mean your controller doesn't have enough axis... |
| 18:59:59 | Heyub | It is literally a joystick, not a controller :P |
| 19:00:03 | raptor | oh, haha |
| 19:00:12 | raptor | interesting - i have no idea how i would set that up |
| 19:02:29 | Heyub | If shooting was seperate from moving it would be very possible, you would always move in the direction your facing though. |
| 19:04:14 | Heyub | Is it possible to set a "D-pad" to do movement? |
| 19:05:36 | raptor | hmmm... |
| 19:05:48 | raptor | not sure, let me look real quick |
| 19:06:15 | raptor | probably not since d-pads are detected as buttons - but then we should be able to set anything we want for any action... |
| 19:07:12 | raptor | nope - movement and shooting are tied to axes.. :( |
| 19:07:54 | Heyub | And it appears you cant set the same axis' to movement and shooting. |
| 19:08:08 | raptor | heh - never tried that |
| 19:08:25 | Heyub | Oh wait, I pulled a LA, didnt save the folder. |
| 19:09:31 | Heyub | LOL trouble is, when aiming that way you gotta keep moving |
| 19:57:25 | IAmBeard | do you gents mostly play bitfighter with a controller rather than keyboard/mouse? |
| 19:59:32 | Renderwahn | the three times i played it i used a ps2 controler |
| 19:59:41 | Heyub | I've never gotten to play it with a controller. |
| 20:03:37 | | Little_Apple has joined |
| 20:03:51 | Little_Apple | yellow |
| 20:06:26 | Heyub | Howdy |
| 20:07:51 | Heyub | Two soccer balls that spawn at different locations, always, is this accomplishable in the .level script or no? |
| 20:14:45 | Little_Apple | :o? |
| 20:19:02 | Heyub | soccer ball X starts at X coordinate, soccer ball Y starts at Y coordinate, by default, whether ball X spawns at X or Y is entirely random, is there a way to make it so ball X always spawns at X. If that clears up the question. |
| 20:22:48 | Little_Apple | AHG! EYE STRAIN >___< |
| 20:23:43 | raptor | actually i'm not sure (regarding the soccerbal) |
| 20:24:03 | raptor | I think you use flag spawns? |
| 20:24:18 | raptor | or one flag spawn and another not? |
| 20:24:23 | Heyub | It tells me there are no flags |
| 20:24:26 | raptor | i'm not much of a level designer |
| 20:24:27 | Heyub | but Ill try that |
| 20:24:32 | raptor | that's ok - ignore the warning :) |
| 20:25:14 | Heyub | Crashes on launch- maybe they need to be neutral |
| 20:25:24 | raptor | oh yikes |
| 20:25:27 | raptor | an actual crash? |
| 20:25:44 | raptor | like game crash? |
| 20:25:50 | Heyub | Uhh sorry, it says "No flags found to respawn" or something then exits |
| 20:26:16 | Heyub | Hmm now they are spawning at 0,0... |
| 20:26:26 | raptor | bah |
| 20:26:29 | raptor | i hate that bug |
| 20:27:50 | Heyub | Nope, if there is a respawn they both respawn at that point. |
| 20:28:43 | Heyub | Though, I may have a more creative way around the problem. |
| 20:33:22 | | Little_Apple Quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) |
| 20:34:02 | Heyub | Ok one more question, do you know how sam increased the size of the asteroids? |
| 20:34:19 | raptor | ha! |
| 20:34:32 | raptor | well... i don't think watusimoto wants that feature to stay in the game... |
| 20:34:34 | raptor | but... |
| 20:34:41 | Heyub | oh? |
| 20:34:57 | raptor | in the editor, click on an asteroid, press <enter>, set size to 4 or 5 |
| 20:35:46 | Heyub | Nice |
| 20:42:05 | IAmBeard | raptor, is the server authoritative over the physics, or do the clients handle most of that? |
| 20:42:24 | raptor | server and client both calculate physics and try to stay in sync |
| 20:42:32 | raptor | when they are different, server *always* overrides |
| 20:43:55 | | sam686 has joined |
| 20:43:55 | | ChanServ sets mode +v sam686 |
| 21:01:29 | IAmBeard | hurrah, the weekend begins now (EST)! |
| 21:01:40 | raptor | almost there myself... |
| 21:02:30 | IAmBeard | what timezone are you in? |
| 21:02:35 | raptor | MST |
| 21:04:23 | IAmBeard | :D |
| 21:04:43 | Heyub | Bitfighter is kind of awkward in wide screen. |
| 21:04:59 | IAmBeard | i'm stepping out for a bit, but I suspect i'll be back in a while |
| 21:05:02 | raptor | full-screen stretched is funny |
| 21:05:48 | Heyub | Put that on a 1920x1200.... |
| 21:08:04 | raptor | yeah, i like the normal fullscreenmode better |
| 21:38:06 | | Frank__ has joined |
| 21:38:24 | raptor | hi Frank__ |
| 21:38:30 | Frank__ | Hello |
| 21:38:39 | Heyub | Hello Frank__ |
| 21:38:45 | Frank__ | Haven't played in a day or so |
| 21:38:53 | Frank__ | Played with y'all the other day though |
| 21:39:08 | Frank__ | as "George Bush" |
| 21:40:03 | Heyub | Oh, welcome back then :) |
| 21:40:12 | raptor | haha |
| 21:41:05 | | kodaws Quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 21:43:51 | Frank__ | How does one add bots to their server? |
| 21:44:10 | raptor | there are several ways |
| 21:44:28 | raptor | there is a INI option to always add a number if there is just one player (I think) |
| 21:44:52 | Frank__ | Alright, cool. Thanks |
| 21:45:26 | raptor | sam686 would know better as his has bots automatically |
| 21:46:42 | | Frank__ Quit (Quit: Page closed) |
| 21:53:10 | | Watusimoto has joined |
| 21:54:12 | Watusimoto | hi |
| 21:54:16 | raptor | hi |
| 21:54:39 | Watusimoto | I'm testing what looks to be a good solution for the lua issues I was working on earlier |
| 21:55:18 | Watusimoto | the whole lua proxying thing |
| 21:56:27 | raptor | ok |
| 21:56:53 | raptor | i found another lua bug last night introduced that i'm trying desperately to remember... it was 2am... |
| 21:57:16 | Watusimoto | ha |
| 21:57:22 | Watusimoto | I'm reading through your email |
| 21:57:27 | raptor | because i made a bot! |
| 21:57:35 | raptor | a horrible hack |
| 21:57:35 | Watusimoto | really! |
| 21:57:43 | Watusimoto | that's great |
| 21:59:15 | raptor | and i've been thinking - we really need to not crash bitfighter when there is a LUA syntax error... |
| 22:05:34 | raptor | there made a minor update to my bot... |
| 22:11:53 | raptor | unless.. we want to crash bitfighter if there is a syntax error? |
| 22:12:59 | raptor | foudn the bug!: if you subscribe to the onPlayerLeft event, any time a player leaves the game crashes |
| 22:16:22 | Heyub | Good job :) |
| 22:27:14 | raptor | well i'm heading out soon, later! |
| 22:27:19 | raptor | and good ngiht Watusimoto |
| 22:27:33 | Watusimoto | later |
| 22:27:53 | Watusimoto | yes, bot error handling needs to be improved |
| 22:27:54 | | raptor Quit () |
| 22:28:07 | Watusimoto | I evicerated it and haven't fixed everything yet |
| 22:31:08 | Heyub | Hey watusimoto, a couple days ago me and raptor talked about the posibility of background objects and wondered your opinion. |
| 22:31:19 | Watusimoto | what do you mean? |
| 22:31:51 | Heyub | Well, the idea was different stars and "planets" an option for planets might be wire frame planets. |
| 22:32:25 | Watusimoto | I've thougtht about that as well. |
| 22:32:52 | Heyub | Thats what raptor said when I first brought it up lol |
| 22:32:58 | Watusimoto | I coded something like that at one point; the code is still there, but it's disabled until I come back to it |
| 22:33:07 | Watusimoto | instead of stars it creates hexagons |
| 22:33:22 | Watusimoto | so it can probably work, and might be cool |
| 22:33:32 | Watusimoto | or it might prove un-necessary distraction |
| 22:34:51 | Heyub | Yeah that was the main thing in question, this spawned form the idea; https://www.box.com/s/dbf2f00a4079cda06ae0 |
| 23:15:47 | IAmBeard | Watusimoto, we meet at last |
| 23:15:50 | IAmBeard | :) |
| 23:16:09 | Watusimoto | oh hi |
| 23:16:29 | Watusimoto | I was just reading through your post and the many replies to it |
| 23:17:10 | Watusimoto | lots of interesting stuff |
| 23:18:38 | Watusimoto | Looking at your idea for moving the website to rails |
| 23:19:27 | Watusimoto | I started a new job in November and we're working in rails, so I'm familliar with the tech |
| 23:20:15 | IAmBeard | yeah, i started doing rails, myself, in September |
| 23:20:17 | Watusimoto | Most of the site is staticish HTML gluing together other packages, like PHPBB/mediaWiki/Drupal |
| 23:20:49 | Watusimoto | I'm not sure if rails would help in that environment, as we handle very little dynamic content directly |
| 23:20:50 | IAmBeard | yeah, i'd build you a unified interface, and it would remove a lot of mess of trying to manage all three |
| 23:20:56 | IAmBeard | and we could probably import forum data |
| 23:21:02 | Watusimoto | it's a bit of a pain |
| 23:21:54 | Watusimoto | we hacked together a shared login system to reduce spam in the wiki -- that reads our phpBB login database |
| 23:22:15 | Watusimoto | not terribly elegant, but it eliminated the spam |
| 23:22:38 | Watusimoto | next up is to require you to have played at least one game of Bitfighter before you can register with the forums |
| 23:22:59 | Watusimoto | I figure that will either eliminate spam altogether, or require the spammers to play, either of which would be wins! |
| 23:23:12 | Heyub | What if someone is having trouble starting bitfighter? |
| 23:23:47 | Watusimoto | then we could help them |
| 23:23:54 | Heyub | How? |
| 23:24:10 | Watusimoto | are you having a problem? |
| 23:24:21 | Watusimoto | or are you asking about it in theory? |
| 23:24:25 | Heyub | In theory |
| 23:25:05 | Watusimoto | Players won't have problems starting Bitfighter, in theory |
| 23:25:24 | Heyub | Men are imperfect, in theory. |
| 23:25:38 | Watusimoto | in practice as well |
| 23:25:48 | Watusimoto | it really depends on the nature of the problem |
| 23:26:22 | Heyub | The point is if someone has an issue starting the game, they cant post on the forums for help. |
| 23:27:20 | Watusimoto | ah, I see |
| 23:27:33 | Watusimoto | to be honest, I hadn't thought about that |
| 23:28:03 | Watusimoto | IAmBeard: >>>Well, yeah it looks like you're tracking score, but what I'm suggesting is tracking things like kills with particular weapons, and points earned in particular game modes. |
| 23:28:58 | Watusimoto | we are tracking a lot of stuff in the database, haven't figured out yet how to use it all. But we have tons of weapon usage stats, and, maybe, some module use stats, as well as kill info and other interesting stuff |
| 23:29:47 | IAmBeard | The best tool for avoiding spam is active moderators who remove and block users who are spamming |
| 23:30:14 | IAmBeard | if we did migrate to rails, it would give us a chance to do some extra security stuff |
| 23:33:28 | IAmBeard | as part of my weekend leasure programming i'll be doing some planning for the rails site, and be diving into the code |
| 23:34:20 | Watusimoto | spam moderation is generally pretty effective, but tiring. I prefer to code! |
| 23:35:04 | IAmBeard | well, developers should have to bear all the weight on their shoulders |
| 23:36:15 | Watusimoto | yes, it's a tough life |
| 23:37:16 | Heyub | Maybeif you include somethingn in one of the .ini files, that way if they cannot start it they can find it in a text file? |
| 23:37:51 | Watusimoto | you're thinking about the idea I mentioned in the forums a few minutes ago, right? |
| 23:37:59 | Heyub | Yeah |
| 23:38:07 | Watusimoto | the idea is to keep automated spam bots from leaving forum messages |
| 23:38:32 | Watusimoto | so instead of a traditional captcha to register an account, we thoguht why not make bitfighter be the captcha |
| 23:38:44 | Watusimoto | if you can play, you're probably human |
| 23:39:13 | Watusimoto | and in most cases, it is helpful to play before posting on the forums |
| 23:39:25 | Watusimoto | so it seems to be a good system |
| 23:39:36 | Watusimoto | except for your theoretcial case |
| 23:40:27 | Watusimoto | though raptor's new captcha system is working pretty well |
| 23:43:31 | Heyub | Oh, on second thought if you did that it probably would be a problem, I forgot you have an email in the contact section. |
| 23:43:45 | Heyub | If someone has issues with it crashing they could send an email... |
| 23:44:08 | Heyub | probably would not be a problem* sorry, typo. |
| 23:44:25 | Watusimoto | that's what I'm thinking |
| 23:44:49 | Watusimoto | but I've had this idea for over a year now, and haven't done anything with it, so don't expect any action soon |
| 23:44:58 | Watusimoto | the spam problme feels pretty under control now |
| 23:48:59 | IAmBeard | it would be worth while to have registration in the installer |
| 23:50:03 | IAmBeard | so you submit your email, it gets pushing into the db with a blank username/password, and you get an email with registration instructions to fill out the rest of the data |
| 23:53:58 | Watusimoto | that would probably work, as long as it doesn't get int he way of casual playing. Now, you get a reserved name/pw by registering with the fourms -- that saves us the trouble of doing any sort of pw management in the game client (i.e. no regerstering, lost pw recovery, etc... a lot of ui work avoided and delegated to the forums) |
| 23:57:52 | | karamazovapy has joined |
| 23:58:22 | Heyub | Hello karmazaovapy! |
| 23:59:59 | Watusimoto | hey karamazovapy |