Timestamps are in GMT/BST.
| 00:13:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | karamazovapy: Can you do me a favour? after the bbb, can you show me the level file and levelgen you have? because that map looked more broken than I seen it before.. :-) thanks. (capt morgan) |
| 01:38:00 | | BFLogBot - Commit dab34ec171bc | Author: watusim...@bitfighter.org | Log: BUGFIX: /shutdown no longer kills client game |
| 01:38:00 | | BFLogBot - Commit 841000549915 | Author: watusim...@bitfighter.org | Log: Improve help text |
| 01:49:00 | | Watusimoto Quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) |
| 04:18:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | karamazovapy: are you here on irc? |
| 04:18:00 | karamazovapy | jes |
| 04:20:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | ok, your pm was blank (I had to quote it to read it..) anyway, so can you confirm both files are full? the script should have a -- EOF comment at buttom, at top should have the name of script, and level file should have 202 lines.. Does yours match that? |
| 04:26:00 | karamazovapy | ( |
| 04:26:00 | karamazovapy | end |
| 04:26:00 | karamazovapy | -- EOF - I now be needing some rum... |
| 04:26:00 | karamazovapy | last line in level file is: |
| 04:26:00 | karamazovapy | Mine 2.39848 -9.76975 |
| 04:26:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | looks about right, but looking in pm quote, i noticed you have an odd botnavmesh zone added.. that wasn't in the orignal file. did you modify level? |
| 04:27:00 | karamazovapy | I added the botnavmesh because it was crashing triangle |
| 04:27:00 | karamazovapy | that's all I did, though |
| 04:27:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | crashing triangle? how so? |
| 04:27:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | whole program crash? |
| 04:27:00 | karamazovapy | in the build I have, for whatever reason, a lot of levels cause triangle to crap its pants and crash the server |
| 04:28:00 | karamazovapy | it's related to auto zone generation |
| 04:28:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | odd, is your build 015a? |
| 04:28:00 | karamazovapy | yep |
| 04:28:00 | karamazovapy | but if you add a navmesh, it signals auto generation not to run |
| 04:28:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | that's weird, my server too has 015a dedicated build no problem.. |
| 04:28:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | no crashes |
| 04:29:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | is the other barrier maker on the same line as botnavmesh? it looks like it in pm, but i could be wrong, maybe that was the cause? |
| 04:30:00 | karamazovapy | level files parse barriermakers whether there are linebreaks or not |
| 04:31:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | ok. I'm looking into that, as it's weird :/ |
| 04:32:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | yup level file is broken. weird. |
| 04:33:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | eh, it was the botnav mesh same line thing causing it. I dropped it a line, reloaded level in editor, and it fixed it.. |
| 04:34:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | you must have disrupted a line somehow.. |
| 04:35:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | well least we know what it was now :-) |
| 04:36:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | i assume the person who took the flag went out of the flag (lol) into space? |
| 04:36:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | or was he good at hiding in maze? |
| 04:36:00 | karamazovapy | space |
| 04:37:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | fair enough |
| 04:39:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | oh i noticed someone noticed my small text on cave control, haha, that was an "easter" egg kinda thing, whether or not anyone will ever figure out what it says is a different story lol |
| 04:40:00 | karamazovapy | lol...yeah, I saw that |
| 04:40:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | did you read it? lol |
| 04:40:00 | karamazovapy | I couldn't really see your butt |
| 04:40:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | hahaha |
| 04:41:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | bet you looked into the level file to see what it said |
| 04:41:00 | karamazovapy | actually, I thought it was stray nonsense in the editor, so I zoomed |
| 04:42:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | haha |
| 04:42:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | one day, someone will read it while playing the level :-) |
| 04:43:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | (via glitch or something) |
| 04:44:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | there are eastereggs in all my levels ;) |
| 04:44:00 | karamazovapy | this was a huuuuuuuuuge turnout |
| 04:44:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | but different things |
| 04:44:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | yeah |
| 04:45:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | sorry i had to bail early, but i have to finish another level i started.. lol |
| 04:45:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | (usually i making 2 levels at a time, when the 1st one gets close to being done, i start on second.. lol |
| 04:45:00 | karamazovapy | no worries |
| 04:48:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | another maze, different game type, but maze will be generated differently and be far more random, while script still being based on morgans |
| 04:48:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | it will have a full homebase for each team, while a maze slap bang in the middle of them both, with flags to get.. (don't worry, it won't be like crazy soccer..) |
| 04:48:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | so far i have the debug functions working..... |
| 04:48:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | nothing else |
| 04:48:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | :-) |
| 04:49:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | I'm going to either generate half of map, or generate each corner of it |
| 04:49:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | or randomize rather |
| 04:50:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | easier just to show when it's done lol |
| 04:50:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | than explain |
| 04:51:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | sadly.. no pirate ships.... |
| 04:53:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | oh and one other thing, thanks for including 3 of my maps :-) |
| 04:53:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | or was it 2? think it was 3 |
| 04:53:00 | karamazovapy | 3 |
| 04:53:00 | karamazovapy | cave control, retrievix, cap'n morg'n |
| 04:53:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | yeah.. how did scoring go on retrievix? |
| 04:53:00 | karamazovapy | ended 3-2 |
| 04:54:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | yeah.. |
| 04:54:00 | karamazovapy | just too hard to get through all those defenses when people are really *playing* |
| 04:54:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | that's good ;) |
| 04:54:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | i never said my levels were made to be easy... |
| 04:55:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | i like games that give me a challange and I play them till I master them, like, i know this will make you laugh, but at xmas someone gave me guitar hero 3 & warriors, I now play the game w/ the plastic guitar on xpert mode.. lol |
| 04:55:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | so it reflects into my levels, i add a challange or try to |
| 04:57:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | my easiest released level is probably cave control, that and the other one, which i hate (yes i hate one of my own levels) |
| 05:09:00 | | koda Quit (Quit: k thx bai) |
| 05:24:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | quote from sky_lark "- A spectator team ought to be created, not for the purpose of spectating, but for the purpose of containing Opti and Lone_Wolf. ;)" - I strongly agree. |
| 05:44:00 | | raptor has joined |
| 05:44:00 | | ChanServ sets mode +o raptor |
| 05:45:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | hey raptor |
| 05:45:00 | raptor | i'm half asleep |
| 05:45:00 | raptor | hi |
| 05:45:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | Why don't ya go to bed then? :-) |
| 05:46:00 | raptor | ok |
| 05:47:00 | raptor | i wanted to ask how the BBB was... |
| 05:47:00 | raptor | i got in two levels with a guest i had over for dinner :) |
| 05:47:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | oh yeah it was fun, but i thought you was there? |
| 05:47:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | but i had to bail early |
| 05:47:00 | raptor | there were like 22 people in each game |
| 05:48:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | yup, quite a few players |
| 05:49:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | turns out those reddit players showed up.. |
| 05:49:00 | raptor | yeah, that was good |
| 05:49:00 | raptor | a nice boost |
| 05:49:00 | raptor | server seemed to hold up well, too |
| 05:50:00 | | zoomber_ibm has joined |
| 05:50:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | yeah, was laggy for me though due to my ping.. lucky for me, i know how to "lag shoot" due to other games like GTA SA:MP mod where to win, you have to lag shoot xD |
| 05:51:00 | zoomber_ibm | crazy |
| 05:51:00 | zoomber_ibm | hi |
| 05:52:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | hey |
| 05:53:00 | | zoomber_ibm has left |
| 05:53:00 | | zoomber_ibm has joined |
| 05:55:00 | zoomber_ibm | stupid wireless keyboard synced to my other computer and doesnt go to my imac anymroe |
| 05:55:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | I had a wireless keyboard once :-D I got rid of it though, due to i got fed up of charging it.. lol |
| 05:57:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | raptor: did you ever get around to checking that patch? |
| 05:57:00 | raptor | oh man - i didn't. i am sorry |
| 05:57:00 | raptor | i had forgotten that we were having guests over |
| 05:57:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | no need to be sorry man. :-) always another time.. |
| 05:57:00 | raptor | like tomorrow! :] |
| 05:58:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | well, when ever you got time really, theres no rush |
| 06:00:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | ah, six am at last :-) |
| 06:00:00 | raptor | time to get up! |
| 06:00:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | yup lol |
| 06:00:00 | raptor | rise and shine! |
| 06:00:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | hahaha |
| 06:00:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | morning dude |
| 06:01:00 | raptor | ok nighty night folks |
| 06:02:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | cya man |
| 06:02:00 | | raptor Quit (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 06:05:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | great now i gotta restart my X server due a a dumb app disabling my second monitor.. brb. |
| 06:05:00 | | CrazyLinuxNerd Quit (Quit: Leaving) |
| 06:06:00 | | CrazyLinuxNerd has joined |
| 06:07:00 | zoomber_ibm | stupid fudgey keyboards. i hate bluetooth stuff |
| 06:08:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | only bluetooth i use on my pc is with my ps3 controllers :-) |
| 06:09:00 | zoomber_ibm | hah wierd, i used a four key passkey somehow |
| 06:09:00 | zoomber_ibm | and now it works |
| 06:09:00 | zoomber_ibm | apples keyboards are mutations |
| 06:09:00 | | CrazyLinuxNerd wonders what would be wrong with a standard usb keyboard.. |
| 06:09:00 | zoomber_ibm | though they say idiotic and beauty go together |
| 06:09:00 | zoomber_ibm | um..wires? |
| 06:10:00 | zoomber_ibm | the fact that my keyboard is a wierd formatted canadian one? |
| 06:10:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | haha, is it on a desk? |
| 06:10:00 | zoomber_ibm | yes |
| 06:10:00 | zoomber_ibm | everything worsk now though |
| 06:10:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | so why worry about wires, unless your moving it around? |
| 06:10:00 | zoomber_ibm | i do like to move it around. depending on how much i really want to type |
| 06:11:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | ah ok, :-) well each to their own i suppose |
| 06:11:00 | zoomber_ibm | and like i said, my usb one has the european format keyboard, and canadian /french key letters on it; im not really sure why it came that way |
| 06:12:00 | zoomber_ibm | there was a reason im sure, always is and was |
| 06:12:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | maybe it wanted to be different? |
| 06:12:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | but i'm tempted to get a dvorak keyboard (or however u spell it) but for now i'm on qwerty :-) |
| 06:13:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | though i cheated, i set my keyboard layout to dvorak, that was confusing.. it worked, but was confusing |
| 06:14:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | but w/ qwerty i can touch type so.. switching to the other means i have to look at the keyboard, which don't work, as the keys on the keyboard don't match what comes out on screen due to a different layout software wise lol xD |
| 06:15:00 | zoomber_ibm | if you have to get a mouse, get http://www.google.com/products/catalog?hl=en&q=apple+magic+mouse&gbv=2&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=shop&cid=11658251056921141193 |
| 06:16:00 | zoomber_ibm | its honestly most elaborate mouse ever, but see if others have trouble connecting it to your bluetooth card before you try it out |
| 06:16:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | i prefer fat mouses... lol |
| 06:16:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | for my big hands xD |
| 06:17:00 | zoomber_ibm | fat mouses are awkward if you go back to them, but this thing lets you scroll like a madman |
| 06:17:00 | zoomber_ibm | its our future |
| 06:17:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | if that's the future i need a time machine to go back.. |
| 06:18:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | plus my mouse has two handy buttons on the side which allow me to go back and forth in a webbrowser (back forward buttons) idk what i'd do without them now.. |
| 06:18:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | when i had to use a mouse without them a couple weeks ago i was hitting side of mouse tryingto go back, only to find no button.. |
| 06:19:00 | zoomber_ibm | i always use delete |
| 06:20:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | my mouse is more like this, but not that at all, and is not wireless |
| 06:20:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | http://www.google.com/products/catalog?hl=en&q=apple+magic+mouse&gbv=2&cid=6093194590885877250&ei=vdS0TqCMCorg4waTsdTcAQ&ved=0CBsQrRI |
| 06:21:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | it be this one https://www.argos.co.uk/static/Product/partNumber/9246195.htm |
| 06:25:00 | zoomber_ibm | oh yeah those |
| 06:25:00 | zoomber_ibm | not really me |
| 06:25:00 | zoomber_ibm | but eh |
| 06:25:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | as for me + wires, loosing 2 wires for keyboard and a mouse, wouldn't make much of a difference in my setup xD |
| 06:25:00 | zoomber_ibm | i liked the old ball-mouse ones |
| 06:25:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | balls aren't precise enough for me |
| 06:26:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | ball mouses.... * |
| 06:38:00 | zoomber_ibm | im going to be going off soon |
| 06:39:00 | zoomber_ibm | gotta try linking my irc servers together now |
| 06:39:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | good luck with that :-) |
| 06:53:00 | | CrazyLinuxNerd Quit (Remote host closed the connection) |
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| 07:00:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | I'm off now :-) cya. |
| 07:00:00 | | CrazyLinuxNerd has left |
| 07:05:00 | karamazovapy | full 3B7 results are up if anyone's curious |
| 07:05:00 | karamazovapy | congrats on winning, sam686 ! |
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| 14:16:00 | | raptor has joined |
| 14:16:00 | | ChanServ sets mode +o raptor |
| 14:16:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | hi raptor |
| 14:17:00 | raptor | good morning |
| 14:17:00 | raptor | err.. good day |
| 14:17:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | haha. Yeah... I hope it stays a good day too. I'm not sure if my system will still be working after my next reboot... I'm dreading it |
| 14:18:00 | raptor | uh oh - what have you done? |
| 14:18:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | you know i told you about my non-vanilla fc14? |
| 14:18:00 | raptor | yes |
| 14:18:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | it's soon to be a non-vanilla fc15 |
| 14:19:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | packages downloaded... prepare and test upgrade..... |
| 14:19:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | here we go xD |
| 14:19:00 | raptor | good luck |
| 14:19:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | i hope this works, considering my fc14 is already running an fc15 kernel and all |
| 14:20:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | and already has a bunch of fc15 packages.. |
| 14:20:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | least theres one thing to know.. Most people reccomend reinstalling when new distro is out, rather than upgrading when it comes to fedora due to the vast amount of changes between releases :-) |
| 14:21:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | I'm sure it'll be fine *looks away with worried grin* |
| 14:21:00 | raptor | does yum no provide a distro-upgrde option? |
| 14:22:00 | raptor | in-place upgrade |
| 14:22:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | i'm using fedora's "preupgrade" utility |
| 14:23:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | then when fc16 comes out i'm going to upgrade to that as well.. (I need to catch up...) but i'm more worried about that, due to fc16 using this https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Grub2 |
| 14:23:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | i know grub legacy very very very well.. but grub2? hmm not so much |
| 14:23:00 | raptor | i think openSUSE |
| 14:24:00 | raptor | next release decided to not use Grub2 |
| 14:24:00 | raptor | because of stability problems |
| 14:24:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | yeaahhh well fedora has never had much of a reputation regarding "stability" |
| 14:25:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | it's getting closer... |
| 14:25:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | DEBUG /sbin/grubby --title="Upgrade to Fedora 15 (Lovelock)" --remove-kernel="/boot/upgrade/vmlinuz" --add-kernel="/boot/upgrade/vmlinuz" --initrd="/boot/upgrade/initrd.img" --args="preupgrade repo=hd::/var/cache/yum/preupgrade ks=hd:UUID=abd3a1f8-c1fb-4f16-939e-088f9476c350:/upgrade/ks.cfg" |
| 14:25:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | ready to begin upgrade.... reboot now.. |
| 14:25:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | oh crap. |
| 14:25:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | I hate this bit |
| 14:25:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | not only is it a reboot, but it's a reboot with changes.. |
| 14:25:00 | raptor | so, I always figured openSUSE and Fedora were very similar in their goals: they are each the semi-bleeding edge platform for RHEL and SLES to test out new stuff |
| 14:26:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | true, but i think fedora is more of a testbed than suse |
| 14:26:00 | raptor | ok |
| 14:26:00 | raptor | i know the SUSE folks slowed down their release cycle for stablity reasons |
| 14:27:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | i'm going to reboot now.. oh crap i hate this ahhhhhh xD wish me luck! :-D. brb.. if it works after that is.. if not time to pull out the toolkit... |
| 14:27:00 | raptor | good luck |
| 14:27:00 | | CrazyLinuxNerd Quit (Quit: Leaving) |
| 14:28:00 | sam686 | GRRR, out of disk space, but, i happen to record everything with no problem leaving only 200 MB left on my hark disk |
| 14:29:00 | sam686 | the problem is when I want to split one video into 2 from a small video editing... |
| 14:29:00 | raptor | oh wow |
| 14:29:00 | raptor | how much space total was used? |
| 14:30:00 | sam686 | BBB7 by itself took 11.1 GB of my disk |
| 14:31:00 | raptor | oh hey - congrats sam686! |
| 14:31:00 | sam686 | but, i still have BBB6 on my hark kisk, taking up about 8.48 GB disk space... |
| 14:31:00 | sam686 | my hard disk capacity is only 75 GB, i want to get a bigger hard disk... |
| 14:32:00 | raptor | hard disks have gone up in price recently because of flodding of many major factories in thailand |
| 14:32:00 | raptor | flooding |
| 14:34:00 | raptor | aww man, watusimoto even beat me in the BBB |
| 14:40:00 | | CrazyLinuxNerd has joined |
| 14:40:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | that went well.. not :/ |
| 14:40:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | booted to a plain and simple blank screen with a flashing _ |
| 14:46:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | right lets try this way.. brb. |
| 14:46:00 | | CrazyLinuxNerd Quit (Quit: Leaving) |
| 15:00:00 | | sam686 Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 15:00:00 | | BFLogBot - Commit 2f733e26ebea | Author: buckyballreaction | Log: Ban duration is in minutes |
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| 15:26:00 | | Guest42463 is now known as sam686 |
| 15:26:00 | | ChanServ sets mode +v sam686 |
| 15:51:00 | | raptor has joined |
| 15:51:00 | | ChanServ sets mode +o raptor |
| 15:51:00 | raptor | good day! again... |
| 15:51:00 | raptor | ok |
| 15:51:00 | raptor | lessons learned from the BBB? |
| 16:41:00 | karamazovapy | lessons learned...I'm looking forward to some of those team controls |
| 16:42:00 | karamazovapy | admin announcements will be nice |
| 16:42:00 | raptor | specifically? |
| 16:42:00 | raptor | ok |
| 16:42:00 | karamazovapy | more than once, opti switched from the losing team to the winning team with about 30 seconds left, and then made sure to announce to everyone that the game was almost over |
| 16:43:00 | karamazovapy | you know what? teams should be locked for the last 1:00 of each game, no matter what |
| 16:43:00 | raptor | ah ha! |
| 16:43:00 | raptor | just what i was wanting to hear |
| 16:43:00 | raptor | i remember a similar discussion from last BBB |
| 16:44:00 | raptor | and how to fix: http://code.google.com/p/bitfighter/issues/detail?id=46 |
| 16:44:00 | raptor | I am remembering something like disallowing team changing in the last 5% of time or 30 seconds of the match, whichever is greater |
| 16:45:00 | karamazovapy | we also discussed disallowing changing to a winning team or a team with more players without admin intervention |
| 16:46:00 | karamazovapy | oooh - another thing that would be nice - if more than one player leaves the same team (just exits the game), it would be nice if there was a setting to have a bot automatically replace them |
| 16:46:00 | karamazovapy | then have the bot quit if a player joins |
| 16:46:00 | raptor | bot balance teams |
| 16:47:00 | karamazovapy | only when players leave mid-game |
| 16:47:00 | karamazovapy | in more than one game, a team had one extra player and the short-sided team had players leave |
| 16:47:00 | karamazovapy | they weren't team changing, they were just leaving |
| 16:48:00 | raptor | sounds like we need ettiquete lessons in school again... |
| 16:48:00 | raptor | i wish i could spell that word properly.. |
| 16:48:00 | karamazovapy | etiquette |
| 16:48:00 | karamazovapy | well I don't totally blame them. sometimes you've gotta go. |
| 16:49:00 | karamazovapy | but it creates landslide games, several of which we had last night |
| 16:49:00 | karamazovapy | we had more shutouts last night than I can remember in any other big match |
| 16:52:00 | karamazovapy | idle players added to the problem, but I think they're a tougher nut to crack, unless we really step up the bot-balancing |
| 16:52:00 | raptor | ok, well, i can implement some of this right now - what do you think about the 5%/30second rule? |
| 16:52:00 | karamazovapy | if we're going that route, I'd say 1:00, but I think switching to a team with more players or more points is a clearer cheaty-indicator |
| 16:55:00 | | BFLogBot - Commit 59d75370266d | Author: watusim...@bitfighter.org | Log: Fix bug: Dock items now get highlighted when you move the mouse over them. Also some minor related restructuring that should increase efficiency. Removed unneeded method. |
| 16:55:00 | | BFLogBot - Commit 35738291579a | Author: watusim...@bitfighter.org | Log: Merge |
| 16:56:00 | karamazovapy | something in the stupid Big Bitfighter Battle VII - PRIZES! thread keeps crashing my firefox |
| 16:57:00 | raptor | really? |
| 16:57:00 | raptor | let me look |
| 16:57:00 | raptor | ok 1 min |
| 16:58:00 | karamazovapy | might just be a trick of the light. never can tell. |
| 16:58:00 | raptor | but, i think that switching to a team with more players or points should be allowed - people might want to just be on teams with friends |
| 16:59:00 | raptor | but maybe disallowed in that last time period... |
| 16:59:00 | raptor | well, that doesn't make sense - it should be blanket disallow in that last time period |
| 16:59:00 | karamazovapy | I think if you want to be with a friend, we should implement the system for team-selecting groups |
| 16:59:00 | raptor | explain |
| 17:00:00 | karamazovapy | you add a tag at the end of your name to be part of a team - presumably the tag isn't visible, but anyone who joins the game with the same tag is sorted as a team |
| 17:00:00 | | BFLogBot - Commit ebca769d83bb | Author: watusim...@bitfighter.org | Log: Comment |
| 17:00:00 | | BFLogBot - Commit 891bc5dcdc62 | Author: watusim...@bitfighter.org | Log: Formatting |
| 17:01:00 | karamazovapy | so if I join as _k#awesometeam and you join as raptor#awesometeam, we're always sorted together, unless it ruins the fabric of spacetime or something |
| 17:01:00 | raptor | interesting |
| 17:01:00 | karamazovapy | or, I guess, unless it's disallowed by the server |
| 17:01:00 | raptor | then would it be up to the server admin to allow team sorting? |
| 17:01:00 | karamazovapy | yeah, I guess, but it'd be allowed by default |
| 17:02:00 | raptor | hmmm |
| 17:02:00 | karamazovapy | it would make preset games easier |
| 17:02:00 | karamazovapy | and would function as de-facto clan support |
| 17:02:00 | karamazovapy | everyone in a clan uses the same secret hashtag |
| 17:03:00 | karamazovapy | if/when the ABFL rises again, it would make life much easier |
| 17:04:00 | karamazovapy | I've brought this up before. you laughed and said it would mean you'd finally win a game. |
| 17:04:00 | | LordDVG has joined |
| 17:06:00 | raptor | would someone insert there secret hash tag on the nickname screen? or maybe in the INI? |
| 17:06:00 | karamazovapy | either/or |
| 17:07:00 | raptor | i think i like the idea - there maybe some coding rough edges to work out.. |
| 17:07:00 | karamazovapy | you would just type it at the end of your normal name |
| 17:07:00 | raptor | did Watusimoto ever comment on it? |
| 17:07:00 | karamazovapy | we talked about it in irc...I think he was around |
| 17:07:00 | karamazovapy | but I think it was also when we were discussing several other things |
| 17:11:00 | Watusimoto | hi -- someone talking about me? |
| 17:11:00 | Watusimoto | RE: what do you think about the 5%/30second rule? |
| 17:12:00 | Watusimoto | I think that should be an option enablable by admins, off by default |
| 17:12:00 | Watusimoto | that could be part of a larger setting that enabled special rules for BBBs and other events |
| 17:12:00 | karamazovapy | http://www.imdb.com/video/imdb/vi899914777/ |
| 17:13:00 | Watusimoto | though if it worked out, we could make it more generably available in future |
| 17:13:00 | Watusimoto | I'm uneasy about doing things that make the game less fun for a small group of people when noone really cares about the outcome |
| 17:14:00 | karamazovapy | watusimoto - we were also talking about preselecting teammates with hashtags |
| 17:16:00 | Watusimoto | great |
| 17:16:00 | Watusimoto | seems a bit clunky, but I think the idea is sound |
| 17:17:00 | karamazovapy | well I don't care how it's implemented, I just think it's a neat idea |
| 17:17:00 | Watusimoto | so playername#team |
| 17:17:00 | Watusimoto | and playername would be used for validation |
| 17:17:00 | raptor | i would suggest not concatenating the two in the entry screen |
| 17:17:00 | raptor | maybe make another field or INI option |
| 17:17:00 | Watusimoto | would the #team be shown as part of the player name |
| 17:17:00 | Watusimoto | ? |
| 17:18:00 | raptor | no |
| 17:18:00 | karamazovapy | I'd say no |
| 17:18:00 | raptor | it would silently allow grouping, i think |
| 17:18:00 | Watusimoto | yeah, make it a different field |
| 17:18:00 | karamazovapy | because then people would leave and rejoin as team members, possibly unwanted |
| 17:18:00 | Watusimoto | interesting |
| 17:18:00 | Watusimoto | right -- everyone on the same team |
| 17:18:00 | karamazovapy | maybe call it Team Code or something? |
| 17:18:00 | Watusimoto | so it would almost serve as a password |
| 17:19:00 | karamazovapy | to keep everyone from typing in Red or Blue |
| 17:19:00 | Watusimoto | or maybe clan code |
| 17:19:00 | Watusimoto | or clan id |
| 17:19:00 | karamazovapy | that'd work |
| 17:19:00 | Watusimoto | or is clan too slangy |
| 17:20:00 | raptor | clique |
| 17:20:00 | raptor | possy |
| 17:20:00 | karamazovapy | well if we were going that route, we could take it a step farther and allow people to register a team and have a set list of members |
| 17:20:00 | Watusimoto | possy -- awesome |
| 17:20:00 | karamazovapy | posse |
| 17:20:00 | raptor | i think i mispelled both of those.. |
| 17:20:00 | raptor | sigh |
| 17:20:00 | karamazovapy | clique was right |
| 17:21:00 | Watusimoto | possy looked wrong... but almost right |
| 17:21:00 | Watusimoto | how would you register a team? |
| 17:21:00 | Watusimoto | I like this idea because it would let my kids be on the same team |
| 17:22:00 | Watusimoto | I don't like this idea because it could lead to a series of really unfair games |
| 17:22:00 | karamazovapy | we mighte be able to allow users to create forum groups and approve new members |
| 17:22:00 | Watusimoto | I think I like a team code better |
| 17:22:00 | Watusimoto | that seems less hacy |
| 17:22:00 | Watusimoto | hacky |
| 17:22:00 | Watusimoto | my goodness |
| 17:24:00 | Watusimoto | but I'm open to the idea, should be easy enough to implement |
| 17:24:00 | Watusimoto | would we want to have a /jointeam command as well? |
| 17:24:00 | | CrazyLinuxNerd has joined |
| 17:24:00 | Watusimoto | /possy |
| 17:24:00 | karamazovapy | /posse |
| 17:25:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | Sorry to tell you this guys.. but I'm back.. |
| 17:25:00 | | koda has joined |
| 17:25:00 | Watusimoto | I think I prefer possy to posse personally |
| 17:26:00 | karamazovapy | possy is too close to pussy for my comfort |
| 17:26:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | lmfao |
| 17:26:00 | CrazyLinuxNerd | that's actually what i thought i read when i entered channel, i had to read it twice.. |
| 17:26:00 | Watusimoto | whoa, dude... this is a family channel |
| 17:27:00 | Watusimoto | you are all a bunch of filthy perverts, in my opinion |
| 17:27:00 | karamazovapy | I wouldn't use "clunt" in an official setting, either. |
| 17:29:00 | Watusimoto | why not? |
| 17:29:00 | karamazovapy | this is more involved, but what if registered teams had a password? |
| 17:29:00 | Watusimoto | seems like an ordinary, unoffensive nonsense word to me |
| 17:29:00 | karamazovapy | then players could register a team as a regular user on the forums |
| 17:30:00 | karamazovapy | also a bit hacky |
| 17:30:00 | Watusimoto | I think if everyone had an optional team id, then players with the same teamid would be matched where possible |
| 17:30:00 | Watusimoto | it wouldn't be exposed, so only people who were told would know it |
| 17:31:00 | Watusimoto | and it could be changed simply by having players change it |
| 17:31:00 | karamazovapy | seems easy |
| 17:31:00 | Watusimoto | the only real question I have is how to keep the game from getting too unbalanced if good players are always paired |
| 17:31:00 | Watusimoto | or should we just not worry about that |
| 17:32:00 | karamazovapy | not sure |
| 17:33:00 | karamazovapy | but sorting should be at least partially ignored if keeping teams together will result in a team having a 2-player advantage or more |
| 17:33:00 | | sam686 Quit (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) |
| 17:34:00 | karamazovapy | maybe the team gets scored as a unit |
| 17:34:00 | Watusimoto | teams would only be preferences... wouldn't have 3v1 |
| 17:34:00 | karamazovapy | then if it's overmatched, it's treated like one really good player |
| 17:35:00 | karamazovapy | or maybe, we even allow uneven teams to advantage the opposition when teams are involved |
| 17:35:00 | Watusimoto | yes, but imaging A+B v C where A and B are experienced players (who are more likely to be using the team thing) and C is a newbie |
| 17:36:00 | karamazovapy | we could disallow teams for groups of 4 or less |
| 17:36:00 | karamazovapy | then over five, it would be A + B v C C C |
| 17:36:00 | karamazovapy | or even A + B v C C C C |
| 17:37:00 | Watusimoto | how would you ever get 2v4? |
| 17:37:00 | karamazovapy | if the two best players are matched together |
| 17:37:00 | karamazovapy | it's plausible |
| 17:37:00 | Watusimoto | not currently, I don |
| 17:37:00 | Watusimoto | t think |
| 17:37:00 | karamazovapy | I've beaten three or four new players single handledly before |
| 17:37:00 | Watusimoto | I think we would always have 3v3 when there aer 6 players |
| 17:38:00 | karamazovapy | it's still a principle. if you don't like 2v4, then think about 5v7 |
| 17:38:00 | Watusimoto | it's not that I dislike it, it's just that it doesn't work that way now |
| 17:38:00 | Watusimoto | I think 2v4 could be very balanced |
| 17:39:00 | karamazovapy | it wouldn't typically happen |
| 17:39:00 | karamazovapy | but let's say people use the feature and get used to playing as a team |
| 17:39:00 | Watusimoto | if we had a better algorithm for assigning teams... |
| 17:39:00 | karamazovapy | I think *actual* teamwork would totally shift the gameplay |
| 17:40:00 | raptor | it's starting to seem like some of our new ideas are dependent on other unimplemented ideas... |
| 17:40:00 | | CrazyLinuxNerd Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 17:40:00 | Watusimoto | how so? |
| 17:40:00 | karamazovapy | namely, the team selection algo |
| 17:40:00 | Watusimoto | oh, I see |
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| 17:41:00 | Watusimoto | we agree that teams are something that lots of people want, and wouldn't be too difficult to implement |
| 17:41:00 | Watusimoto | I like the idea of disabling teams with 4 or fewer players |
| 17:42:00 | Watusimoto | we could also make the assumption that players on the same team will likely be better than the average unaffiliated player |
| 17:42:00 | karamazovapy | team selection adjustments wouldn't break compatibility as a server-side update |
| 17:42:00 | Watusimoto | so maybe we could use that, and in the case of an odd number of players, if there is only one team, it gets the fewer number of players |
| 17:43:00 | karamazovapy | even then, I think we need to work on the math |
| 17:43:00 | Watusimoto | and if there are two teams, they will not be lumped together |
| 17:43:00 | raptor | Watusimoto: have you or sam686 already adjusted the individual scoring algo to be just kill/death ratio? |
| 17:43:00 | karamazovapy | I'm imagining Little_Apple and FoOtloOse teaming up on a server with me, sam, and zoomber |
| 17:43:00 | Watusimoto | no |
| 17:44:00 | Watusimoto | good poing |
| 17:44:00 | Watusimoto | t |
| 17:44:00 | Watusimoto | or me teaming up with my kids -- they're a bit stronger than I am |
| 17:44:00 | karamazovapy | maybe we should think about a system for scoring team effectiveness |
| 17:44:00 | raptor | baby steps |
| 17:45:00 | Watusimoto | yes |
| 17:45:00 | Watusimoto | and we also agree that servers should be able to disable teams |
| 17:45:00 | karamazovapy | how will the k/d ratio team selection work? |
| 17:45:00 | karamazovapy | just sort out every other player? |
| 17:45:00 | raptor | i thought you were the one who came up with that, karamazovapy |
| 17:46:00 | karamazovapy | well I came up with using k/d, but I never talked about how it would function |
| 17:46:00 | karamazovapy | this is a lot more complicated, but what if we attempted to create two teams with equal aggregate k/d sums? |
| 17:47:00 | raptor | that's what i was figuring from the start... do posse sorting, then apply the individual scores again to sort teams |
| 17:47:00 | karamazovapy | so if we have four players, 5:1, 3:1, 3:1, 1:1, the team pairing is 5:1 + 1:1, 3:1 + 3:1 |
| 17:47:00 | | CrazyLinuxNerd Quit (Quit: Leaving) |
| 17:48:00 | raptor | (I am assuming the last two pages of discussion about 'teams' meant 'posse') |
| 17:49:00 | karamazovapy | I am assuming that teams currently just trade off 1/3/5/7 vs 2/4/6/8 |
| 17:49:00 | Watusimoto | http://pastebin.com/3Fq3FpVr |
| 17:49:00 | Watusimoto | that's my current idea |
| 17:50:00 | Watusimoto | alter as you see fit |
| 17:51:00 | Watusimoto | wait... you can't alter these pasties? |
| 17:51:00 | raptor | rounded down? |
| 17:51:00 | karamazovapy | I'm not sure how to code my idea |
| 17:52:00 | karamazovapy | but I'm talking about the k/d selection algo before posse concerns enter into it |
| 17:53:00 | karamazovapy | here's the coding problem I don't know how to solve |
| 17:53:00 | karamazovapy | I give you ten numbers |
| 17:54:00 | karamazovapy | I want you to sort them into two groups with equal sums |
| 17:54:00 | karamazovapy | the number of terms in each group is irrelevant |
| 17:55:00 | karamazovapy | so if I give you 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 200, your groups should be 200, 1+2+3+4+5+6+7+8+9 |
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| 17:55:00 | karamazovapy | because that's the closest you can come |
| 17:56:00 | Watusimoto | brb |
| 17:57:00 | karamazovapy | for our purposes, the two largest terms will always be in opposite groups |
| 17:58:00 | karamazovapy | even though 1, 2, 3, 3, 4, 5 could work out to 4+5, 1+2+3+3, for our basic sorting we would rather have 5+3+1, 4+3+2 |
| 17:58:00 | | zoomber_ibm Quit (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 17:59:00 | karamazovapy | taking this a step further than I really want to at the moment, if 4 and 5 are a posse, I would allow 4+5, 1+2+3+3 |
| 17:59:00 | raptor | interesting |
| 17:59:00 | raptor | so you would allow unbalanced teams |
| 18:00:00 | karamazovapy | sure, if the math works |
| 18:00:00 | | zoomber_ibm has joined |
| 18:00:00 | raptor | i was figuring the overriding rule would be equal numbers of playes |
| 18:00:00 | karamazovapy | because those teams aren't actually unbalanced |
| 18:00:00 | raptor | players |
| 18:01:00 | karamazovapy | if k/d ratio really works as an indicator of skill, then sub in real k/d ratios for the numeric terms |
| 18:01:00 | karamazovapy | realistically, the values won't be so different |
| 18:02:00 | karamazovapy | so 4+5 v 1+2+3+3 is unlikely |
| 18:02:00 | karamazovapy | but it's plausible |
| 18:04:00 | karamazovapy | anyway, if that's the way we look at it, dominant teams are only as good as their sum worth |
| 18:04:00 | karamazovapy | maybe we even give the group a k/d ratio |
| 18:05:00 | karamazovapy | so the guy with 3 kills and 1 death gets covered up a bit by the teammate with 1 kill and 30 deaths |
| 18:05:00 | karamazovapy | 4:31 team ratio instead of two individuals with 3:1, 1:30 |
| 18:06:00 | karamazovapy | or the even worse mistake, averaging the team ratios |
| 18:07:00 | karamazovapy | erm...averaging the individual ratios to get a team ratio |
| 18:07:00 | karamazovapy | you'd want to add the actual kills and deaths |
| 18:07:00 | raptor | statistics.. |
| 18:07:00 | karamazovapy | right. so small numbers don't throw things way off |
| 18:09:00 | Watusimoto | dinner time... back later |
| 18:09:00 | raptor | k |
| 18:09:00 | karamazovapy | reality...back later |
| 18:09:00 | raptor | food.. ditto |
| 18:14:00 | | Watusimoto Quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) |
| 18:17:00 | zoomber_ibm | hi |
| 18:21:00 | | LordDVG Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 18:45:00 | | sam686 has joined |
| 18:45:00 | | ChanServ sets mode +v sam686 |
| 18:52:00 | raptor | hi sam686, did you fix this already?: http://code.google.com/p/bitfighter/issues/detail?id=139 |
| 18:52:00 | zoomber_ibm | hi |
| 18:54:00 | raptor | hello |
| 19:00:00 | | CrazyLinuxNerd Quit (Quit: Leaving) |
| 19:19:00 | sam686 | i think multiple words in team name was fixed along with TextItem fix... |
| 19:20:00 | sam686 | but i will check.. |
| 19:58:00 | | raptor Quit (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 20:44:00 | | Watusimoto has joined |
| 20:44:00 | Watusimoto | hi |
| 20:44:00 | sam686 | hi.. |
| 20:45:00 | Watusimoto | k you there? |
| 20:45:00 | Watusimoto | I think I know how to solve your dividing numbers into groups problem you posed earlier |
| 20:45:00 | Watusimoto | hi sam |
| 20:45:00 | Watusimoto | quite a game last night |
| 20:46:00 | Watusimoto | congratulations |
| 20:46:00 | sam686 | yes.. |
| 20:51:00 | | BFLogBot - Commit 02a8451e5000 | Author: sam8641 | Log: Fix script single arg quote problem, Fix compiling dedicated. |
| 20:51:00 | | BFLogBot - Commit f0912c8231e1 | Author: sam8641 | Log: Fix script single arg quote problem (somehow wasn't in previous commit) |
| 20:51:00 | Watusimoto | I've never seen that many people play |
| 20:51:00 | Watusimoto | I think it has never happened |
| 20:52:00 | Watusimoto | the scoreboard can't handle that in 1-team games |
| 20:56:00 | sam686 | http://bitfighter.org/gamereports/?days=30&server=BITFIGHTER%20BASH So, about half (maybe less then half) of the number of big battle game is over 20 players |
| 21:15:00 | | sam686 has left |
| 21:21:00 | Watusimoto | well, it was still a ton of players |
| 21:21:00 | | sam686 has joined |
| 21:21:00 | | ChanServ sets mode +v sam686 |
| 22:34:00 | | raptor has joined |
| 22:34:00 | | ChanServ sets mode +o raptor |
| 22:35:00 | raptor | howdy folks |
| 22:37:00 | raptor | sam686: do your recent commits fix that issue? |
| 22:38:00 | sam686 | try putting in space in team names, i don't see the problem in 016 anymore, where it was a problem in 015 |
| 22:38:00 | raptor | ok, i'll close issue |
| 22:40:00 | sam686 | where, without the fix, Team water blue 0 0 1 will cause water and blue be a seperate arguments and mess it all up, but Team "water blue" 0 0 1 will work.. |
| 22:42:00 | raptor | hav eyou seen this?: http://code.google.com/p/bitfighter/issues/detail?id=140 |
| 22:42:00 | raptor | i don't understand it... |
| 22:46:00 | sam686 | i think thats the result of trying to make sure snapping won't go through the wall, it won't let you use speedzone unless you can snap into speedzone without going through walls.. |
| 22:58:00 | sam686 | take this for example http://208.107.52.15/bitfighter/speedzone_on_wall.png if snapping is enabled, you would be going through walls and be trapped inside, right? |
| 22:59:00 | sam686 | it is currently checked to make sure ships won't go through walls when trying to snap.. |
| 23:00:00 | raptor | i guess i don't understand what 'snapping' does |
| 23:01:00 | sam686 | snapping helps in some cases so ships won't go flying in a little bit into wrong direction |
| 23:04:00 | raptor | ohhh... snapping jumps the ship to be aligned with the go fast |
| 23:04:00 | raptor | interesting - i had no idea |
| 23:05:00 | sam686 | yes, it helps when speedzone is pointing into a tiny opening far away.. |
| 23:17:00 | raptor | so the question is - is issue 140 even an issue? |
| 23:18:00 | raptor | Watusimoto: A couple days ago I added a README to the root of our code tree to help people with compiling. I didn't add windows instructions, though |
| 23:19:00 | raptor | so you or sam686 are welcome to... :) |
| 23:27:00 | Watusimoto | @r great! |
| 23:35:00 | raptor | I hope it reads well |
| 23:44:00 | Watusimoto | wow -- found a huge memory leak!!! |
| 23:45:00 | raptor | hooray! |
| 23:45:00 | raptor | did i cause it? |
| 23:45:00 | Watusimoto | nope |
| 23:45:00 | raptor | LUA? |
| 23:45:00 | Watusimoto | it's been there since zap days, I think |
| 23:46:00 | Watusimoto | just checked in patch |
| 23:46:00 | Watusimoto | the credits scroller wasn't properly deleted when you quit the game. |
| 23:46:00 | Watusimoto | well that's a bit of good work! |
| 23:46:00 | raptor | haha |
| 23:46:00 | | BFLogBot - Commit 745a7f5fddea | Author: watusim...@bitfighter.org | Log: memory leak!!!! |
| 23:46:00 | | BFLogBot - Commit 8488229f9e22 | Author: watusim...@bitfighter.org | Log: Merge |
